Why faith has a place at work with Stacy Brown-Philpot

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Somebody took a chance on me. That person had faith. We are taking chances. Like we're investing in a Series A company. We have no idea if this business is going to go from $3 million to zero or $3 million to $300 million. We don't know. We have done all the data. We have done all the analysis, but we are still making a bet. So what's the difference between making a bet and having faith? Intuition comes up a lot in my work. It's something you've probably heard me talk about with guests on this show. Every great leader seems to have their own way of knowing, a foundation they build their decisions on, even when the data is incomplete or even when smart people they trust disagree with them, even when there's no clear right answer. For some people, like Adam Grant, the compass is research and evidence. For others, like Patty Stonecipher, it's a value system, a mission statement that she returns to again and again. For me, it's experience, pattern recognition that I've built up over decades of watching people navigate hard things at work. Today, I want to explore a way of knowing I haven't talked about yet on this show, one that shapes how a lot of people lead, make decisions, and find meaning at work, but almost never comes up in professional conversations. That is faith, actual faith, the religious kind. And I don't just mean faith as a belief system. I mean faith as a way of operating, a compass, something that tells you what matters, how to treat people, and what to do when everything else is uncertain. I'll be up front. I was not raised religious and faith is not a big part of my life. But I have learned that one of the most valuable things you can do is listen carefully to how someone else navigates the world, especially when their tools are different from yours. So today, I'm listening and learning. What does that kind of faith actually look like at work, in real decisions, and in hard moments? I'm Molly Graham, and this is WorkLife, where we untangle the messy human side of work. My guest today is Stacey Brown-Philpott. Stacey grew up in Detroit, went to Wharton, and built a career at Google where she ran global operations, among many other things. She then became CEO of TaskRabbit, leading the company through global expansion and an acquisition by IKEA. She is now the founder of Cherry Rock Capital, where she backs underrepresented entrepreneurs building transformative companies. She also sits on a lot of corporate boards. Stacey has, by any measure, had one of the most impressive careers in tech of the last two decades. Recently, I hosted a fireside chat with Stacey. She talked about leadership, decision-making when the path isn't clear, and being willing to speak up for what you believe in. And then, at the end of our discussion, someone in the audience asked her about her faith. In the moment, she gave a quick answer. But it made me realize there is so much here. So today, we're going to go deep with Stacey on her faith to understand what it means to her personally and professionally, what she's learned from bringing her faith into her work, and what we can learn from it, even if religion isn't central to our lives. Stacey, welcome to WorkLife. Thank you. Thank you for having me, Molly. I'm so glad you're here. So I want to start by asking, I've heard you say that faith is central to your work and your life. But I want to understand, what does faith mean to you? There's a Bible scripture that says that faith is the substance of things hoped for and the evidence of things not seen. And I grew up as a kid hearing that all the time. Just growing up with my grandmother and my mother, and they would talk about having faith when we didn't have certain things that we wish we had. And you've got to have faith. And they would quote that scripture. And at some point, it became real for me, which is I had hopes and dreams. I didn't know where they were going to come from. And the only thing that I could draw on was my faith that things would happen in my life through prayer and persistence and effort that would allow those things to materialize. So you said faith is the substance of things hoped for and the evidence of things not seen. Will you explain that just one level deeper to me? Yeah. When you think about your life and you go through things you hope for, I remember when I was 27, I wanted to get married and have kids by the time I was 30. I had this whole plan. It's different than a plan. A plan is a thing that you come up with. But the substance of things hoped for is like, you're just not really sure how this is going to happen. Like when I was raising the fund for Cherry Rock, I knew what my plan was. I knew I was going to go meet a lot of people and have a lot of meetings, but I wasn't sure exactly how it was going to come together. And that gap, that emptiness of how, that's the faith part. And then on the evidence of things not seen, it's like, well, I didn't see it, but when it does come to fruition, this is proof that faith is the reason why this happened. And I have a couple of stories around that. We were getting very close to our target and I wasn't sure if we were going to exceed the target or not. This is when you were fundraising for Cherry Rock? Fundraising for Cherry Rock. And it was not clear if we were going to get past 100 million. And we wanted to raise at least 150. And I was praying and we were doing all the things. We were having the meetings. We were following up with people. And I said, well, all right, we just have to have some faith. Like we're doing everything that we can. And I remember going to church and sitting in the service and our pastor gave this wonderful story about how this woman prayed for a certain amount of money to start a company. And she actually exceeded that goal and received that money. And I said, I'm just going to pray for a certain number. And I'm just going to have some faith that somebody shows up and gives us that number. And I remember talking to my partner about us and, you know, say that I went to church. I prayed for this number. And she's like, yeah, well, we got this one LP. They're going to come in and this is the number. So that's not the higher number. I'm praying for this higher number. He said, well, I'm not sure that's going to happen. I wasn't either. Two weeks later, they called and said, we have some good news. Please come in and meet with us. And I go into the meeting and sure enough, they're like, we were really impressed with what you're building. We're going to give you 50% more than the number that you prayed for. They didn't even know I prayed for that number. And so I'm sitting there. I'm so happy, Molly. I am like, this is beyond. I had no comprehension of how that happened. But I love hearing about your Grammy. She reminds me of you, which I'm sure is a compliment. But I'm curious about how you have brought faith into your work and how it has shown up in your professional life. It's been a journey. I would say my mom really has helped me with this, I call it like a tug of war of when you stand up and demonstrate your faith because she lives it. Like, mom runs a nonprofit and it's to help homeless people and, you know, and at the same time, they minister to people, but it's not like, they don't have church there. They just talk to people. And through that, they connect. And watching her build that nonprofit helped me see over the course of my career, how do I really represent who I fully am? And one of the earliest moments where I did that was when I was at TaskRabbit, I talked about my faith in a one-on-one conversation with someone. He was a person of faith too, but different than mine, not Christian, something else. And he came back and said, you know, we should start an interfaith group at the company. And I was like, a what? And he's like, yeah, what do you think? And I was like, and I'm CEO of the company. And I said, sure, why not? And we started the group and people were so happy. We had lots of members join. They were coming in, people representing different faiths. Like, it was this amazing, amazing story of how people of different faiths can come together and just talk and share and be happy that they can be out with their faith. It's like one of the things, like the LGBTQ plus community like has a struggle with coming out. I have to say that sometimes Christians, we struggle with being out, especially in Silicon Valley where we don't want to be judged. We don't want to be critiqued. We want to fit in and we don't want people to think that we're not, we don't believe in science because we go to church, right? And you can believe in science and go to church and both of those things can be true. And so that early experience of seeing that and watching that community come together was incredible. And after that, George Floyd happened and that group really helped connect and allow for stories to be shared. And remember, we were all doing COVID. And so it was all virtual, but because we had that grounding and that footing as a company and as a team, like people could open up and share the trials and the experiences and the emotions and everything that they were going through around that time. And so I share that memory because when I look back, I was like, Oh yeah, create the group. But in hindsight, it was one of the most powerful things we did for the company. Yeah. So TaskRabbit was actually pretty, not late in your career, but not the beginning. And that means through your whole career at Google, you didn't talk about your faith at all before that? I don't think I talked about it in large groups. And I went to church on Sundays and I was a person of faith and I would come back the next Monday and say, What did you do this weekend? Oh, we went to church. But I never really talked about what I did there, what I learned. I remember working some Sundays when I was at Google and feeling guilty about it, thinking, oh, this is supposed to be my day of rest, but here I am working at this company because we're growing really, really fast. And I remember even earlier than my time at Google, being in roles where I would work and not go to church and not, you know, set aside my time with God because I wanted to be successful and I didn't want to let people down. By the time I became the CEO, I could set the schedule and I could set the tone for what was expected. I wasn't asking you to believe what I believe, but I wanted you to respect my time and what I believe. And I felt like then I had the platform, the ability, the power to really do it and to say, I'm not available on Sunday mornings. And if we wanna have a call, we can do it after 2 p.m. on Sunday, but not after five because that's when we have family dinner. Saying some of those things when you're the employee is, was harder to do, admittedly. And it helped me too, because once I had kids, the same thing happened where I could set time and boundaries for spending time with my children. It's easier to do when I was CEO of the company. This episode is brought to you by Quince. You know those pieces in your closet you just keep reaching for? The ones that work for a board meeting, a dinner, a flight, sometimes all in the same day? That's the whole philosophy behind Quince. 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And I sent it to someone I dearly care about and trust. And it was before we officially started the fundraising process. And I wanted feedback. And he said to me, he's like, you should be careful using this language as one of your values. And I said, why? Because I came up with those values. It was a representation of who I am to your point about being a leader. It was a representation. And so some people might think it's more of a biblical thing and you're not an impact fund and you're a fund that's going to generate returns and you don't want to turn people off. And I was shocked. And I had to really sit down and think about, whoa, wait, I do believe we leverage our faith as much as our intellect. I think both of those things go together. I want to raise this fund. I don't want to turn people off. But this is a part of who I am. And so I struggled in the first probably few months of fundraising to define like how I was going to talk about that value if it came up as a question. And eventually I started giving you the scripture that I gave you at the top of this conversation. And people would wow at it and say, oh, okay, that's interesting. And then I would say, somebody took a chance on you. That person had faith. Somebody took a chance on me. That person had faith. We are taking chances. Like we're investing in a series A company. We have no idea this business is going to go from $3 million to zero or $3 million to $300 million. We don't know. We have done all the data. We have done all the analysis. But we are still making a bet. So what's the difference between making a bet and having faith? It's kind of the same thing, except I have God behind my bet. You know, it's not like Las Vegas. So it's just like that to me was a big, important moment for how I was going to lead this firm, how we were going to hire people. And in the process, I said, you know what? 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That's Claude.ai slash worklife. And check out Claude Pro, which includes access to all of the features mentioned in today's episode. Claude.ai slash worklife. This episode is brought to you by Framer. One of the biggest advantages a team can have is the ability to adapt quickly. The best tools don't just help you build something well, they help you keep making it better. That's the idea behind Framer. It's a complete website platform, not just a builder. So your team can launch and keep improving in one place. What sets Framer apart is that AI agents work directly inside the canvas. The same place where the real site is designed, managed, and published. Agents help draft pages, manage content, and optimize SEO. So your team can review, refine, and publish all without leaving the tool. Agents bring the speed and scale and your team brings the taste, judgment, and final call on what goes live. 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And so maybe they had a terrible experience in the church or somewhere around their faith journey that really turned them off. So they don't ask because they don't want to, they don't want to live that part of their life anymore. And they don't want to talk to you about it, especially if you had a good experience. And then the third reason is being judged, right? You have so many reasons to not bring it up. And there's so many other questions you can't ask that you just don't ask the questions. You just don't even go there. So I'm curious if there's someone listening that like, you know, has a faith life that's, that's central to who they are, but feels like they can't bring it into professional spaces. Like what would you tell them? I would tell them to just pray about it and pay attention to God's moments to introduce it. Because they may feel like I can't introduce it. But God knows that there is a way if that's what they want. And just allow for the space to be filled by God to lead them in the right direction to do it. I remember sharing my faith over and again with somebody, even with my team. And they all know I go to church and some, we all have different versions of faith on the Cherry Rock team. And we were getting ready to go out for our first AGM. And it was in person. It was the first time we were sort of presenting the fund to all of the LPs who committed. We had the founders who had, we had invested in backstage. And we're getting ready to start. And someone on the team was like, let's pray before we go out there. And I was like, And I would, I, I didn't ask. And we all held hands and she said a prayer. And then we went and we had an amazing thing happen. And so I don't think we've talked about faith. I don't think I've introduced it. But somebody else was like, let's pray. So even just showing up as a person of faith, not bragging about it, but just being who you are is an example in a way that you might not even appreciate right now, is what I would say to that person. Okay, I have sort of a slightly different question to ask you, which, but it's something someone said to me recently. And I can't stop thinking about it, which is someone said to me that they think that a lot of people have replaced religion with work. Do you see that? Does that resonate with you? I can see how your sole sense of being is to, especially if you're a founder, give birth and bring life to this company. And so many people think you can't do it. Like all the VCs who said no until somebody said yes. All the customers you try to sell your product to who said no until somebody said yes, right? You can almost develop a God-like complex of like, well, if I went through all of this and this thing is still happening, I must be something special. I must be, right? And so, and then I get people to follow me and boy, now my company has 5,000 people, 10,000 people, 50,000 people. And it's all, you know, that's, that's, that's the religion. The religion is what we're building, what we're selling, and look how it's impacting people's lives and changing people's lives and making the world a better place. Like I can, yes, I can see. And people might say that that's a, that's, that's the definition of a religion. But there's one thing about my religion that I believe, which is that after I'm done here on this earth, like there's something more for me and that whatever I'm doing, it's not just about me. And I'm not sure that I go to work, everybody who goes to work, like a company is not preparing heaven for me. No, that, I don't think so. I don't think so. So it's different, but I could see how, especially in the founder community, there's a bit of that religion that you have to have, especially when it's in the early days and you're trying to win and you're trying to get it out there. Like you have to have some real commitment that could mirror a commitment to a faith or to a religion. Yeah, and I think part of what people are saying is that it's where folks derive like meaning and a sense of identity. Do you know what I mean? And because like part of what I hear you saying is like, I know my life is valuable separate from my work. Like my work is part of that, but I, I have this inner clarity um about what I am here for and what is waiting for me. And I think part of what I hear when people are like work might have replaced religion for some set of people is like that they have invested their whole being and sense of meaning into into work and then work lets you down, you know? That's right. And I feel you have a language for suffering and, and sort of like that the struggle is part of the purpose. What do you think happens when people don't have that? Yeah. So thank you for articulating another way to look at this issue. Yes, if you bank all your meaning into your work, whoa, if work lets you down, you get fired, you leave, the company goes under, or you decide you don't like it anymore. Wait, now I don't have a sense of purpose. I don't have a sense of, of meaning. That is a horrible place to be. And my reaction is, that's why it's not healthy to attach your sense of meaning to what's on this earth, like what's here right now. I have two kids and I love them so much, but my high schooler is gonna go to college in three and a half years. I, I can't attach my whole sense of meaning to her because she's gonna have her own life someday. And if I'm sitting around waiting on her to show up, she barely responds to my text messages now. It's a wrap. It's not happening, right? So, so I, I think, you know, I, I want people to think about what's a greater purpose. And Chris, my husband, always talks about having community and beyond your work that you do every day, is there a community that you're a part of that you can serve, that you can give back to? Because that adds to a sense of meaning and a sense of purpose. I'm not saying go to church and become a Christian in order to have purpose. That's not what I'm saying. But having a community, I'm involved in this, you know, I love, you know, mentoring kids, so I'm gonna go do that. I love teaching pickleball. I'm gonna go do that, right? Something that allows you to connect with other people outside of your work creates a sense of meaning and purpose beyond the thing that you spend, you know, most of your waking hours doing. And I think allows all of us to open up to the fact that, you know, we are, you know, the sum is greater than the parts and that we are here for more than just one thing. I love that. 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